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Post by killer on Feb 20, 2007 11:03:40 GMT -5
I think I failed in getting my point across. Is it my communication skills or some other obstacle? Either way, I will stop trying here.
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Post by outcast on Feb 20, 2007 19:36:10 GMT -5
He went too far. Whatever one thinks about homosexuality, saying that gays shouldn't be allowed in the US, or in the world? What if he'd said it about Jewish people, or African-Americans? We wouldn't even be having this discussion. Jewish people, and African-Americans are ordained by God, gays are a abomination period! Not even the same class hmm I may not last too long on this forum lol ;D
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Post by richbrout on Feb 21, 2007 8:16:06 GMT -5
Why would you care how other adults live their lives? In a FREE country by the way.
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Post by outcast on Feb 21, 2007 16:21:19 GMT -5
Why would you care how other adults live their lives? In a FREE country by the way. fact is I don't, I could careless how other adults live their lives,
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Post by phinehas on Feb 21, 2007 20:13:00 GMT -5
I care. How I live my life affects those around me. How other people live their life affects me and depending on what they do, it affects me in different ways and vice versa. People spreading a fatal virus around due to behavioural actions is something that needs to be addressed differently then it is now. Innocent people are affected and it is not right. Huge resources are being diverted from being used in a way that makes life better for people. Instead it's being used to band aid bad decisions of people around the world. That is a waste of time and resources.
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Post by lawman on Feb 21, 2007 23:05:10 GMT -5
I care. How I live my life affects those around me. How other people live their life affects me and depending on what they do, it affects me in different ways and vice versa. People spreading a fatal virus around due to behavioural actions is something that needs to be addressed differently then it is now. Innocent people are affected and it is not right. Huge resources are being diverted from being used in a way that makes life better for people. Instead it's being used to band aid bad decisions of people around the world. That is a waste of time and resources. Absolutely right! People (Christians) are afraid to speak out because of the Politically correct BS!!! You, I and 'killer'.....have been and should even stronger!!!!!
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Post by richbrout on Feb 22, 2007 7:59:53 GMT -5
Sorta like fat people overeating and getting diabetes? Alcoholics continuing to drink? Smokers? Gamblers?
The world is full of people who in your opinion may make "bad decisions". I thought your crowd's mantra was "no Nanny government", except in the bedroom huh?
I think there hasn't been any lack of Christians voicing their displeasure with gay people. This is really a moot point. Attitudes towards gays have softened and attitudes among young people towards gays are very accepting.
Why do Christians think their opinion matters about how other people live their sexual lives. Its so hypocritical. They don't say peep about heterosexual infidelity, promiscuity, the ridiculous 50% divorce rate....No when they start to think of how to address "Sexual issues" to work on they want to start with (by definition) someone else's "sin"-Didn't Jesus say take care of the beam in your eye and don't worry about the splinter in your neighbor's.
I'm not gay, but I do know AMERICA is about FREEDOM for ALL PEOPLE.....what two consenting adults do in the privacy of their own home is their business!!!
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Post by lawman on Feb 22, 2007 8:04:13 GMT -5
If so, then why did God destroy Sodom and Gommorah?
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Post by richbrout on Feb 22, 2007 8:08:25 GMT -5
The Bible says to stone fortune tellers but you don't see much of that. Stoned any fortune tellers lately??? the bible says it...why aren't you stoning fortune tellers? The bible says alot of things....we don't run our country based on the Bible.
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Post by richbrout on Feb 22, 2007 8:09:20 GMT -5
Lets leave the destroying to God. and judging too while we are at it.
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Post by richbrout on Feb 22, 2007 8:12:13 GMT -5
I have been heterosexual every second of my life. There is NO WAY I could CHOOSE to make myself attracted to a man...its ALIEN to my brain.
Could you guys "choose" to be attracted to men???
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Post by lawmanguest on Feb 22, 2007 8:17:53 GMT -5
The Bible says to stone fortune tellers but you don't see much of that. Stoned any fortune tellers lately??? the bible says it...why aren't you stoning fortune tellers? The bible says alot of things....we don't run our country based on the Bible. True Christians are led by God. PERIOD People that 'try' to follow God's teachings because it makes sense as you stated will 'do' what their emotions (flesh) dictate to them! Have you read in the 'Holy Bible' All flesh is enmity against God?
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Post by richbrout on Feb 22, 2007 8:20:06 GMT -5
THe Bible says if your eyes cause you to lust aftera woman rip them out for it is better to lose your eyes than your souls...see many blind Christians? Shouldn't heterosexual Christians START with HETEROSEXUAL sins? ??
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Post by richbrout on Feb 22, 2007 8:22:09 GMT -5
There are MANY people in this country that are not Christian and many that do not believe in God. They have all the rights that you do and this is as much THEIR country as yours.
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Post by lawman on Feb 22, 2007 8:24:33 GMT -5
THe Bible says if your eyes cause you to lust aftera woman rip them out for it is better to lose your eyes than your souls...see many blind Christians? Shouldn't heterosexual Christians START with HETEROSEXUAL sins? ?? God is the ONE who does the STARTING .....and FINISHING in the life of the Christian! HE says to rebuke, reprove, admonish!
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Post by richbrout on Feb 22, 2007 8:26:47 GMT -5
JESUS said take care of the BEAM in your own eye and don't worry about the splinter in your neighbors.
But if you think a successful strategy for bringing people to Christ is to run around and "rebuke,reprove and admonish"....go for it....I think you will find it counterproductive to your goals.........gotta run to work..later
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Post by family1st on Feb 22, 2007 9:14:05 GMT -5
What two or more consenting adults do in the privacy of their home is between them. Herein lies the problem. Gays are bringing their disgusting and abominable behavior outside the home for all to see and are trying to have their unions recognized by the state. If states recognize these unions, how long do you think it will be before cries of discrimination are heard against churches and businesses who don't want to legitimize or accept them? WHO'S forcing their will on whom Rich??
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Post by lawman on Feb 22, 2007 9:20:29 GMT -5
Beautiful response, Family1st! Something told me to let someone else reply to rich's last post!
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Post by family1st on Feb 22, 2007 9:39:48 GMT -5
Sorta like fat people overeating and getting diabetes? Alcoholics continuing to drink? Smokers? Gamblers? The world is full of people who in your opinion may make "bad decisions". I thought your crowd's mantra was "no Nanny government", except in the bedroom huh? I think there hasn't been any lack of Christians voicing their displeasure with gay people. This is really a moot point. Attitudes towards gays have softened and attitudes among young people towards gays are very accepting. Biblical morals haven't changed, just some peoples heart's. Why do Christians think their opinion matters about how other people live their sexual lives. Its so hypocritical. Is it? What about peoples reactions to certain other disgusting/morally wrong behaviors ie: pedophilia, necrophilia, bestiality. Will you be championing their causes next Rich? They don't say peep about heterosexual infidelity, promiscuity, the ridiculous 50% divorce rate....No when they start to think of how to address "Sexual issues" to work on they want to start with (by definition) someone else's "sin"-Didn't Jesus say take care of the beam in your eye and don't worry about the splinter in your neighbor's. I agree with you 100% on this. Mainstream Protestant churches are nothing more than glorified country-clubs and bastions of iniquity. Also, Jesus told the woman caught in adultry "Go and sin no more". I'm not gay, but I do know AMERICA is about FREEDOM for ALL PEOPLE.....what two consenting adults do in the privacy of their own home is their business!!! SO KEEP IT IN THE HOME!!!!
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Post by phinehas on Feb 22, 2007 10:32:49 GMT -5
Sorta like fat people overeating and getting diabetes? Alcoholics continuing to drink? Smokers? Gamblers? The world is full of people who in your opinion may make "bad decisions". I thought your crowd's mantra was "no Nanny government", except in the bedroom huh? I think there hasn't been any lack of Christians voicing their displeasure with gay people. This is really a moot point. Attitudes towards gays have softened and attitudes among young people towards gays are very accepting. Why do Christians think their opinion matters about how other people live their sexual lives. Its so hypocritical. They don't say peep about heterosexual infidelity, promiscuity, the ridiculous 50% divorce rate....No when they start to think of how to address "Sexual issues" to work on they want to start with (by definition) someone else's "sin"-Didn't Jesus say take care of the beam in your eye and don't worry about the splinter in your neighbor's. I'm not gay, but I do know AMERICA is about FREEDOM for ALL PEOPLE.....what two consenting adults do in the privacy of their own home is their business!!! My argument wasn't about being gay. It was about behaviour (homosexual, needle drug use, promiscuity) that is spreading the AIDS virus. If the AIDS virus stays in their bodies and in their bedrooms, then I don't have a problem, it's their life to destroy. However, the reality is that it doesn't stay in their bedroom but enters into other bedrooms and my tax money, that could go to other things that are productive, is being routed to deal with this. Sorta like fat people overeating and getting diabetes? Alcoholics continuing to drink? Smokers? Gamblers?
"The world is full of people who in your opinion may make "bad decisions."Yes, the world is full of people making bad decisions....so what. The reality is that these people's decisions affect me. One of them being my tax dollars, therefore I think I have a say in trying to reduce the affects on me, whether it's at the start or end of the problem. What is the root cause of resources being diverted for the AIDS issue? Isn't it AIDS? If pleading for people to be careful ("safe" sex) after twenty years isn't working, which it isn't, then another means of attacking the problem must occur.
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Post by richbrout on Feb 22, 2007 11:05:07 GMT -5
First Family- They are AMERICANS, they have no more obligation to keep it in the home then you do in regards to things you may do that other people find abhorent. I find your self rightous indignation, disgusting and abominable and Anti-Christian....but in a free country you can be a self rightous, judgmental, religious freak all you want no matter how much it disgusts people like me. You don't have to keep it in your house...lucky for you.
As a heterosexual it doesn't affect me if gays are allowed to marry.
Phin-my point is why are you worried about Aids and not heart disease, lung cancer and emphesema. I mean these are HUGE compared to Aids and are greatly affected by smoking. If you look at them as societal problems they aren't even close....this leads me to suspect your motives of just dealing with other people's decisions that result in costing you money.
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Post by killer on Feb 22, 2007 11:30:53 GMT -5
Is there a link in the rising number of gays or maybe the "gay in your face" everywhere and what seems to be lots of child porn/sex with children?
Not suggesting that the gays are responsible for the child porn. But is all the "sexual preference" talk everywhere contributing to the depraved society?
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Post by phinehas on Feb 22, 2007 12:11:51 GMT -5
"......why are you worried about Aids and not heart disease, lung cancer and emphesema. I mean these are HUGE compared to Aids and are greatly affected by smoking. If you look at them as societal problems they aren't even close....this leads me to suspect your motives of just dealing with other people's decisions that result in costing you money."
True. They are both behaviour related diseases that are preventable for the most part. The difference is that you don't see "safe" smoking ads or other programs that promote the continuance of the bad behaviour, ie. smoking. The MESSAGE is to QUIT the behaviour. The same can not be said for the MESSAGE in regards to the behaviours that spread AIDS.
Homosexual behaviour - Message = Do what you want, it's a personal choice, just be "safe" and use a condom.
intravenous drug use - Messgae = Do what you want, it's a personal choice, just be "safe" and use a clean needle.
Promiscuous sex - Message = same as homosexual message.
but....
Cigarettes - Message = STOP! It will kill you and harms the health of others around you.
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Post by family1st on Feb 22, 2007 17:28:44 GMT -5
First Family- They are AMERICANS, they have no more obligation to keep it in the home then you do in regards to things you may do that other people find abhorent. I find your self rightous indignation, disgusting and abominable and Anti-Christian....but in a free country you can be a self rightous, judgmental, religious freak all you want no matter how much it disgusts people like me. You don't have to keep it in your house...lucky for you. As a heterosexual it doesn't affect me if gays are allowed to marry. Phin-my point is why are you worried about Aids and not heart disease, lung cancer and emphesema. I mean these are HUGE compared to Aids and are greatly affected by smoking. If you look at them as societal problems they aren't even close....this leads me to suspect your motives of just dealing with other people's decisions that result in costing you money. Rich... you don't know anything about being a Christian. You can't pick and choose what you want to believe to alleviate your lack of morals and judgement. Oh, and from looking at your previous posts, being self-righteous and judgemental appear to be YOUR primary traits.
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Post by richbrout on Feb 22, 2007 18:48:18 GMT -5
So you stone fortune tellers? You ever lust after a woman? Ever rip your eyes out afterward?
Of course I can use the brain God gave me to differentiate. I don't take the bible literally in many cases. Did Noah run around and find a male and female of every species on Earth? Are we all decendents of incest? Did Adam father a child when he was like 800 or 900n yearls old??
Of course not but that has nothing to do with the message of Jesus Christ. I Am not the kind of Christian you are, but I don;t care if you consider me a christian or not. Maybe if I went to a MULTI-MILLION $ MEGA-CHurch(maybe like Ken Haggard's), and treated christianity like it was an Amway business, and only socialized with people that think just like I do...maybe then I'd be more like your kinda christian. You are the one that is LOST.
HYPOCRIT!!
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Post by lawman on Feb 22, 2007 19:50:43 GMT -5
First Family- They are AMERICANS, they have no more obligation to keep it in the home then you do in regards to things you may do that other people find abhorent. I find your self rightous indignation, disgusting and abominable and Anti-Christian....but in a free country you can be a self rightous, judgmental, religious freak all you want no matter how much it disgusts people like me. You don't have to keep it in your house...lucky for you. As a heterosexual it doesn't affect me if gays are allowed to marry. Phin-my point is why are you worried about Aids and not heart disease, lung cancer and emphesema. I mean these are HUGE compared to Aids and are greatly affected by smoking. If you look at them as societal problems they aren't even close....this leads me to suspect your motives of just dealing with other people's decisions that result in costing you money. Rich... you don't know anything about being a Christian. You can't pick and choose what you want to believe to alleviate your lack of morals and judgement. Oh, and from looking at your previous posts, being self-righteous and judgemental appear to be YOUR primary traits. rich, YOU ARE SO BRUTALLY WRONG.......and 1st family is SO BRUTALLY correct, honest and TRUE.....that I'm not positive God may have sent an Angel to ADDRESS this matter! I guarantee HE sent Angels to Sodom and Gommorrah! Also, I think you would not be wise calling this person a freak! You have been very HYPOCRITICAL! If you're not born-again, rich, THE 'LIGHT' IS NOT ON!
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Post by tragicpizza on Feb 22, 2007 20:37:09 GMT -5
If so, then why did God destroy Sodom and Gommorah? According to Scripture, inhospitality.
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Post by richbrout on Feb 22, 2007 21:21:19 GMT -5
I'm sure you can find plenty to agree with you Law.
The Megachurches are full of them.
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Post by phinehas on Feb 22, 2007 21:30:56 GMT -5
Is there a link in the rising number of gays or maybe the "gay in your face" everywhere and what seems to be lots of child porn/sex with children? Not suggesting that the gays are responsible for the child porn. But is all the "sexual preference" talk everywhere contributing to the depraved society? I think it is. With freedom comes responsibility and control. Americans don't possess either anymore.
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Post by phinehas on Feb 22, 2007 21:35:53 GMT -5
If so, then why did God destroy Sodom and Gommorah? According to Scripture, inhospitality. Actually, the story that put focus on what had become common behaviour in those cities was a mob of men wanting two men to come out of a house they were guests in, so that they could be homosexually raped. If I had to make an educated guess, I would say those cities were so abhorent in their hedonistic tendencies of depravity in all forms but especially in a sexual nature, they were made an example, justly so, for others.
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