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Post by blondie on Mar 26, 2007 6:10:51 GMT -5
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Post by bamagatr on Mar 26, 2007 6:49:41 GMT -5
Nice...exploiting dead soldiers to shove your ideology...
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Post by blondie on Mar 26, 2007 8:38:05 GMT -5
Nice...exploiting dead soldiers to shove your ideology... I think we need to remember this noble soldier and appreciate his unusually perceptive mind.
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Post by bamagatr on Mar 26, 2007 9:07:54 GMT -5
I think we need to remember this noble soldier and appreciate his unusually perceptive mind. And, of course, ignore and impugn all the ignoble ones who have the audacity to disagree with his perceptiveness?
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Post by deovindice on Mar 26, 2007 9:17:27 GMT -5
I'll second that. Absolutely tacky.
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Post by blondie on Mar 26, 2007 9:38:04 GMT -5
I think we need to remember this noble soldier and appreciate his unusually perceptive mind. And, of course, ignore and impugn all the ignoble ones who have the audacity to disagree with his perceptiveness? Please have some respect. This man gave his life for our country.
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Post by dixiepixie on Mar 26, 2007 9:43:49 GMT -5
Dang, he was a hottie. Best we can do now is pray for his poor lost soul.
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Post by phinehas on Mar 26, 2007 11:03:06 GMT -5
blondie - How do you know he wasn't praying to God as he was dying? The term of no atheists in foxholes is for when a person is in the moments of facing death or dying, they will call out to God.
Having been in situations growing up where I certainly could have died, I am more inclined to think this occurs with atheists just as it would with agnostics or religious people. The point being of the quote is that there are no atheists and at best, only agnostics.
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Post by blondie on Mar 26, 2007 11:46:52 GMT -5
blondie - How do you know he wasn't praying to God as he was dying? The term of no atheists in foxholes is for when a person is in the moments of facing death or dying, they will call out to God. Having been in situations growing up where I certainly could have died, I am more inclined to think this occurs with atheists just as it would with agnostics or religious people. The point being of the quote is that there are no atheists and at best, only agnostics. How do you know all the Christian soldiers don't renounce their God as they are dying? No matter how scared or in pain I am I'm not going to become a Wiccan. Neither are you.
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Post by dixiepixie on Mar 26, 2007 11:58:31 GMT -5
Kind of reminds me of a joke I heard the other day:
An Atheist was walking in the woods when he was charged by a huge bear. The Atheist cried out "Oh, God save me!" The Lord responds "You have denounced me your entire life, but when the need is greatest you call on me." The Atheist thinks on it, and says"You are correct. It would be hypocritical to ask for your help now, when I have never believed before. But could you at least make the bear a Christian?"
The bear falls to it's knees, folds it's paws and begins to pray"Dear Lord, thank you for this meal I am about to receive..."
I will repeat it again....If I am wrong about God, then nothing happens at death. But if I, along with all other people of faith are correct, a lot of Atheists are in trouble...I would start praying now, if I were you, blondie.
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Post by deovindice on Mar 26, 2007 12:01:38 GMT -5
Amazing creativity. Stretched to the point of breaking.
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Post by blondie on Mar 26, 2007 12:15:30 GMT -5
Amazing creativity. Stretched to the point of breaking. Did you notice I was responding to Phinehas' point? "blondie - How do you know he wasn't praying to God as he was dying?"
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Post by phinehas on Mar 26, 2007 12:17:53 GMT -5
blondie - How do you know he wasn't praying to God as he was dying? The term of no atheists in foxholes is for when a person is in the moments of facing death or dying, they will call out to God. Having been in situations growing up where I certainly could have died, I am more inclined to think this occurs with atheists just as it would with agnostics or religious people. The point being of the quote is that there are no atheists and at best, only agnostics. How do you know all the Christian soldiers don't renounce their God as they are dying? No matter how scared or in pain I am I'm not going to become a Wiccan. Neither are you. Why would somebody calling out for help, renounce the only person that can help them? Doesn't happen blondie. It also is not logical to actually renounce something...the very act of renouncing would be for the purpose of something you no longer believe in to know you no longer believe? That doesn't make sense at all.
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Post by blondie on Mar 26, 2007 12:21:02 GMT -5
I will repeat it again....If I am wrong about God, then nothing happens at death. But if I, along with all other people of faith are correct, a lot of Atheists are in trouble...I would start praying now, if I were you, blondie. If you're wrong about the Muslim God you're going to burn in hell for all eternity. That's how Pascal's wager was shot down hundreds of years ago. In fact, Pascal's wager demands you go with the religion with the best heaven and worse hell.
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Post by dixiepixie on Mar 26, 2007 12:27:38 GMT -5
I will repeat it again....If I am wrong about God, then nothing happens at death. But if I, along with all other people of faith are correct, a lot of Atheists are in trouble...I would start praying now, if I were you, blondie. If you're wrong about the Muslim God you're going to burn in hell for all eternity. That's how Pascal's wager was shot down hundreds of years ago. In fact, Pascal's wager demands you go with the religion with the best heaven and worse hell. Actually, it is my belief that ALL faiths are based on the same God, it is man that has perverted God to suit their own needs. But you wouldn't know anything about what I believe, you just want to slam people of faith. I am willing to bet it's because YOU are so insecure in your own beliefs, you can not stand it that others find peace and hope in their faith.
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Post by phinehas on Mar 26, 2007 12:28:15 GMT -5
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Post by blondie on Mar 26, 2007 13:51:01 GMT -5
If you're wrong about the Muslim God you're going to burn in hell for all eternity. That's how Pascal's wager was shot down hundreds of years ago. In fact, Pascal's wager demands you go with the religion with the best heaven and worse hell. Actually, it is my belief that ALL faiths are based on the same God, it is man that has perverted God to suit their own needs. But you wouldn't know anything about what I believe, you just want to slam people of faith. I am willing to bet it's because YOU are so insecure in your own beliefs, you can not stand it that others find peace and hope in their faith. You brought up Pascal's wager. It doesn't make any since if you're a new-ager or a Hindu. Do you think the Satanists worship the same god as you? How about Zeus, does he count? Ganesha? Shiva? Ishtar? What about the great big idol with the golden head? Does it count? The golden calf? David Koresh? Just for the record it was you that insulted me as usual. I'm very secure in my beliefs. Why shouldn't I be? 100% of the evidence backs me up.
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Post by phinehas on Mar 26, 2007 13:53:42 GMT -5
blondie,
"100% of the evidence backs me up."
What evidence do you have that backs up your belief? Please present this evidence.
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Post by blondie on Mar 26, 2007 14:02:43 GMT -5
We agree about Islam. My point was if you are going to use Pascal's wager you are logically obligated to go with Islam. I recently heard that a lot of the Christian ideas about heaven and hell are from the Koran. I haven't researched it yet, but that would make since. I know a lot of it comes from Dante and he was heavily influence by Islam
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Post by blondie on Mar 26, 2007 14:08:09 GMT -5
blondie, "100% of the evidence backs me up." What evidence do you have that backs up your belief? Please present this evidence. Once again, we agree about all the thousands of gods out there but one. Seems to me yours is just like the others. Make believe. I know you think yours is unique but that's what everybody says. Here's the best documented miracle of all times. Makes Jesus look like a chump: www.milkmiracle.com/
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Post by dixiepixie on Mar 26, 2007 14:14:09 GMT -5
Actually, it is my belief that ALL faiths are based on the same God, it is man that has perverted God to suit their own needs. But you wouldn't know anything about what I believe, you just want to slam people of faith. I am willing to bet it's because YOU are so insecure in your own beliefs, you can not stand it that others find peace and hope in their faith. You brought up Pascal's wager. It doesn't make any since if you're a new-ager or a Hindu. Do you think the Satanists worship the same god as you? How about Zeus, does he count? Ganesha? Shiva? Ishtar? What about the great big idol with the golden head? Does it count? The golden calf? David Koresh? Just for the record it was you that insulted me as usual. I'm very secure in my beliefs. Why shouldn't I be? 100% of the evidence backs me up. Are you really this stupid? YOU brought up Pascal, not me. You have just assumed all along that you know how others think and believe, then you try and fit us all into neat little boxes that match YOUR beliefs on OUR beliefs. If life were that simple and easy, we would ALL have it made.
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Post by phinehas on Mar 26, 2007 14:15:15 GMT -5
I didn't, you brought up Pascal's wager. It's a logical fallacy. I have determined Islam is wrong by what it espouses, not to mention it is an obvious copy, twisted at that, of Judeo-Christianity.
The Christian religion IS unique in that it is the only religion, excluding the continuation of Judaism, which Christianity is, were God himself saves us from judgement versus all other religions, that rely on human's good works or enlightenment balanced in favor of bad works.
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Post by phinehas on Mar 26, 2007 14:29:11 GMT -5
"Here's the best documented miracle of all times. Makes Jesus look like a chump: www.milkmiracle.com" You must be joking. Let's see, bringing people back from the dead, healing people that coudn't walk or see from birth versus a statue "drinking" milk. Even if the statutes were drinking the milk, minus human intervention, such as a hole in the statue with a slight vacuum, etc, how is that trumping what Jesus did? You like to get absurd with your attack on Christianity don't you? Oh, I woudn't call it documented since nobody was allowed to examine the statues.
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Post by phinehas on Mar 26, 2007 14:33:55 GMT -5
blondie,
You still have not presented any of this evidence that atheism is correct and that there is no God.
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Post by W.O.M.I on Mar 26, 2007 15:04:56 GMT -5
blondie may have a pont here.
Using him and those who think as he does as a yardstick, you could forgive a soldier the fleeting thought that perhaps his God has deserted him.
After all, it's readily apparent a sizable portion of the American public, led by the 'leaders' of the Democrat party, has....
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Post by blondie on Mar 27, 2007 8:35:23 GMT -5
"Here's the best documented miracle of all times. Makes Jesus look like a chump: http://www.milkmiracle.com" You must be joking. Let's see, bringing people back from the dead, healing people that couldn't walk or see from birth versus a statue "drinking" milk. Even if the statutes were drinking the milk, minus human intervention, such as a hole in the statue with a slight vacuum, etc, how is that trumping what Jesus did? You like to get absurd with your attack on Christianity don't you? Oh, I wouldn't call it documented since nobody was allowed to examine the statues. Best documented. If you're going to believe in the supernatural this is a good place to start. There are plenty of ancient tales of the supernatural. None caught on video tape. I don't find this absurd at all, but it does lead to a point. Many religious arguments reveal a blatant cultural bias. Ask yourself, why do you dismiss the milk miracle out of hand, (like I do) yet believe the extraordinary claims of Christianity (unlike me)? I believe this is a clear example of special pleading.
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Post by blondie on Mar 27, 2007 8:40:47 GMT -5
blondie, You still have not presented any of this evidence that atheism is correct and that there is no God. I don't think you can prove a negative. I can only assert that all of the arguments for the existence if God, that I'm aware of have been refuted. Unless you redefine "god" in such a way as to be something I believe in, like "god is everything." This Is why I'm big about defining terms. I'm sure when you say God you're referring to the Trinity of Christianity
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Post by espy on Mar 27, 2007 10:05:23 GMT -5
blondie, You still have not presented any of this evidence that atheism is correct and that there is no God. I don't think you can prove a negative. I can only assert that all of the arguments for the existence if God, that I'm aware of have been refuted. Unless you redefine "god" in such a way as to be something I believe in, like "god is everything." This Is why I'm big about defining terms. I'm sure when you say God you're referring to the Trinity of Christianity God is God....you ether believe or you don't. Let it go blondie....
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Post by phinehas on Mar 27, 2007 10:10:02 GMT -5
"I don't think you can prove a negative"
Then stop saying that you have evidence that there is no God then.
"I can only assert that all of the arguments for the existence of God, that I'm aware of have been refuted."
WRONG - they have been rebutted not refutted.
as far as what you stated in another thread:
"Christians just aren't used to having their opinions challenged. They think it's an insult that people don't use flattering terminology to describe their belief system."
If you think Christians are not used to having their beliefs challenged then you have been living in a closet. Christianity has been the most attacked belief system in history. There are endless pundits, news programs, books and movies that are used in the attempt to discredit or bring in doubt Christianity. Problem is, you can't defeat truth in the end.
"Willful ignorance, mythology and even brainwashed are just descriptions. They're not personal insults."
No, they are insultive and you know it. You use these terms in order to artifically bolster your arguments, because frankly, you don't have any real ammo.
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Post by blondie on Mar 27, 2007 10:26:44 GMT -5
"I don't think you can prove a negative"Then stop saying that you have evidence that there is no God then. "I can only assert that all of the arguments for the existence of God, that I'm aware of have been refuted."WRONG - they have been rebutted not refutted. as far as what you stated in another thread: "Christians just aren't used to having their opinions challenged. They think it's an insult that people don't use flattering terminology to describe their belief system."If you think Christians are not used to having their beliefs challenged then you have been living in a closet. Christianity has been the most attacked belief system in history. There are endless pundits, news programs, books and movies that are used in the attempt to discredit or bring in doubt Christianity. Problem is, you can't defeat truth in the end. "Willful ignorance, mythology and even brainwashed are just descriptions. They're not personal insults." No, they are insultive and you know it. You use these terms in order to artifically bolster your arguments, because frankly, you don't have any real ammo. My only point is there is no good reason to believe. If you don't believe I have any "real ammo," you're unfamiliar with the debate. I've read dozens, if not hundreds of books on this subject and am not familiar with a single argument for theism that stand up to scrutiny. In America today It usually comes down to special pleading. For instance, did you even consider that the Milk Miracle was real? Even for a split second? Why not?
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