lovinusa
Cog in Training
God Bless the USA
Posts: 78
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Post by lovinusa on Jan 11, 2007 16:23:56 GMT -5
With an aging population going on Medicare (more and more every day) this is an important issue that isn't talked about enough. I work in a field that deals with some of these issues everyday. I talk to people who need "things" and have to choose between meds or food every month. As a compassionate person I truly worry about these people because they are either alone or are too proud to ask for help. Congress sees fit to remove more and more benefits all the time. If something is not done soon there will be no choices for these people. We all need to worry about it someday someone you love will need these benefits.
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Post by brandon on Jan 11, 2007 20:21:05 GMT -5
If something is not done soon there will be no choices for these people. Actually, they'll have a couple of choices. 1. Stop being a freeloader and make their own way in life. 2. Die.
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Post by phinehas on Jan 11, 2007 22:38:14 GMT -5
Society needs to get back to children taking care of their parents.
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Post by brandon on Jan 11, 2007 22:45:53 GMT -5
Society needs to get back to children taking care of their parents. You just summed it all up in one sentence. The parents have taken care of their kids all their lives. Now the burden of taking care of the parents should rest with the children. But why would the children give up their weekend at DisneyWorld when the government will buy their medicine?
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lovinusa
Cog in Training
God Bless the USA
Posts: 78
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Post by lovinusa on Jan 12, 2007 8:41:27 GMT -5
So what about the folks with no children to take care of them? Are you also saying I need to take all of my retirement money to take care of my mother (which I will prbably do) My Mother (just as an example) worked for AT&T for over 20yrs in IL she had a great retirement fund, notice I said had. She had a heart attack about 6 yrs ago her meds even with insurance cost her over $300.00 a month. When she turns 65 this year and retires she will lose her insurance and what ever money she has left will be gone within a yr or two then medicare takes over. Are you aware all you get automattically is hospital insurance not medical or prescription insurance. which means her cost for meds alone will skyrocket to over $1500 a month. Not to mention that if she wants the medical and presription coverage she will have to pay extra and alot of her meds are not covered. I can go on and on but I think you get the point here. Yes I will help her anyway I can because she is my mother and because she has helped me so much, but there is only so much I can do. At least She has me and my brothers but what about the others who have no family to take up this burden???
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Post by brandon on Jan 12, 2007 10:02:03 GMT -5
what about the others who have no family to take up this burden??? Ever hear of Natural Selection? People weren't meant to live until they're 110. If they're rich and can get the meds they need to live a century, then that's great. If they don't have enough money to live to a hundred, then why should they become a burden to me? Why should I have to pay for someone's great great great grandmother to live an extra 20 years to sit around useless watching Pat Sajak? What do you think would've happened in 1920 before all of these super expensive miracle drugs? They would've died when they were supposed to. I'm sorry your mom is old, but I just get tired of everyone always asking the government to steal money from my pocket to pay for their own personal hardships. Buy insurance and save money for pete sake.
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Post by phinehas on Jan 12, 2007 10:22:36 GMT -5
I agree with Brandon and would add that if people want to live a longer time, they need to take care of themselves while younger, don't smoke and generally don't over indulge on anything and they won't have disease initiated heath problems later in life.
They will age to around 75 or 80 and die.....
Those that have genetic diseases will die off when they are supposed to.
The desire of self preservation is only surpassed by the love for others, that being said, people need to know when to let it go. I for one will refuse to take medications costing $1,000 a month or more if it woudn't be offset by my responsibilities, ie. when your over 65 for example and don't have dependants that still rely on you.
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lovinusa
Cog in Training
God Bless the USA
Posts: 78
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Post by lovinusa on Jan 12, 2007 10:40:14 GMT -5
tell that to my 5yr old "sorry kid your grandmas too old she needs to die so get over it " my Grandfather live well into his 80's never used medicare and was never on expensive meds but he still lived that long Thank God BITE ME!!!!!!
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Post by brandon on Jan 12, 2007 11:42:52 GMT -5
tell that to my 5yr old "sorry kid your grandmas too old she needs to die so get over it " What's a good phone number for your 5 year old? Someone needs to tell him/her about the hardships of life and peronal responsibility since your child will obviously be taught to depend on my tax money for support.
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Post by phinehas on Jan 12, 2007 11:46:32 GMT -5
tell that to my 5yr old "sorry kid your grandmas too old she needs to die so get over it " my Grandfather live well into his 80's never used medicare and was never on expensive meds but he still lived that long Thank God BITE ME!!!!!! BITE ME? Don't take this personal...these are discussions between people, were not deciding legislation here.
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Post by billt on Jan 12, 2007 12:02:14 GMT -5
brandon and corny(yes i knew it was you even though you shange names like the coward you are) thank both of you for showing what disgusting humans you are.
PUNKS that know nothing......the people getting medicare PAID FOR IT, from their own funds.
you young PUNKS have done nothing to support me or any other older person.
these discussions in this threads are between a couple of intelligent folks and the IGNORANT.....how dare you sugg3est older people should just DIE!
that is the problem you PUNKS didnt get to be around older folks in your youth and that is why you are so IGNORANT of even basic concepts.
brandon and corny i call both you PUNKS out, meet me at the bowling center next wednesday night i will will disuccs YOUR suggestion that i DIE face to face!
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Post by phinehas on Jan 12, 2007 12:08:07 GMT -5
brandon and corny(yes i knew it was you even though you shange names like the coward you are) thank both of you for showing what disgusting humans you are. PUNKS that know nothing......the people getting medicare PAID FOR IT, from their own funds. you young PUNKS have done nothing to support me or any other older person. these discussions in this threads are between a couple of intelligent folks and the IGNORANT.....how dare you sugg3est older people should just DIE! that is the problem you PUNKS didnt get to be around older folks in your youth and that is why you are so IGNORANT of even basic concepts. brandon and corny i call both you PUNKS out, meet me at the bowling center next wednesday night i will will disuccs YOUR suggestion that i DIE face to face! OMG....you take things way to personal. Don't start this stuff again, please. Argue against what we say or don't post anything, all the name calling and stuff is immature, especially from somebody with your experience and knowledge in life.
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Post by brandon on Jan 12, 2007 12:09:44 GMT -5
you young PUNKS have done nothing to support me or any other older person. If I recall correctly, you're getting a government check, so a mere "thank you" would be nice of you to share with the rest of us non-indigents. these discussions in this threads are between a couple of intelligent folks and the IGNORANT.....how dare you sugg3est older people should just DIE! I will spell it out more clearly this time since you seem a bit daft: If someone reaches the age of 60 and can not pay for their own bills and health care, they obviously didn't care much about paying for their doctor bills and should die rather than steal money from me. brandon and corny i call both you PUNKS out, meet me at the bowling center next wednesday night i will will disuccs YOUR suggestion that i DIE face to face! As much as you want me to be evil, I don't beat up old crippled men that hang out at the bowling alley.
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Post by billt on Jan 12, 2007 12:11:38 GMT -5
brandon thank you for showing the board what a keyboard commando you are.
beat up??? LOL
PUNK you suggested that i "die".
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Post by brandon on Jan 12, 2007 13:11:25 GMT -5
you suggested that i "die". But not at my hands. You can die just fine by yourself. I at least have that much confidence in you. You come onto all the forums acting as if you're some sort of freedom loving libertarian, but as soon as someone suggests that we take away your government checks, then you're all up in arms. I think I've figured it out. You're against anyone else getting a government handout, except for yourself.
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Post by billt on Jan 12, 2007 13:52:44 GMT -5
BS pure and simple...you are talking about taking away something i EARNED, there is no handout involved in collecting what you have paid for!
and yes i take offense when some young clown suggests they are paying my way and i should "DIE".
i PAID my own way before you were born brandon!
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Post by bomastr on Jan 12, 2007 14:34:59 GMT -5
Billt, I think the money you paid in was used for someone else at the time. The money you are collecting now is being paid by present taxpayers. If you look at your records, you will notice you are collecting a lot more than you paid.
Brandon, chill man.
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Post by phinehas on Jan 12, 2007 15:04:37 GMT -5
brandon,
It could be argued that the seniors now, made up of the greatest generation, are about the only group of people that genuinely deserve to be taken care of by the following generations via government if the 60s generation does not do it for them via family. They sacrificed a lot for their children and children's children, which make up my generation.
That being said, they were suckered into trading their values of self determination, hard work and self reliance into allowing the government to become their mothers. The younger generation closing their doors and skirting their responsibilities and pointing them towards the door of government. How ironic, that generation going through the depression and the hard hard work they did and sacrifices they made for their children...only for their children to turn their backs, the end result being that the children in later generations will feel the slap to the face via taxes due to the burden that wasn't carried in the past.
I would say that you don't have to chill and that your words are valid, if not towards billt specifically, but in general, applies to a lot of people.
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Post by brandon on Jan 12, 2007 15:23:28 GMT -5
That being said, they were suckered into trading their values of self determination, hard work and self reliance into allowing the government to become their mothers. The younger generation closing their doors and skirting their responsibilities and pointing them towards the door of government. How ironic, that generation going through the depression and the hard hard work they did and sacrifices they made for their children...only for their children to turn their backs, the end result being that the children in later generations will feel the slap to the face via taxes due to the burden that wasn't carried in the past. That's well said. I do think that the generation that followed the New Deal was fooled into believing that socialism was going to save everyone and create a utopia. What it turned into is a ponzi scheme, as you described, where the beneficiaries end up collecting a lot more in payouts than they ever paid in, while the current generation of workers is footing the current payouts. As much as I've paid into SS and medicare, if they would just stop taking it out of my check then I'd be glad to call it even and never ask for a cent in return.
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Post by dixiepixie on Jan 12, 2007 16:19:39 GMT -5
As much money as I pay in twice a month, I hope SOMEONE is getting some use from it, becaue I sure as Hell ain't seeing it. And by the time I am ready to retire, social security will be sucked dry by people getting a check who do not deserve nor appreciate it.
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Post by billt on Jan 12, 2007 17:27:01 GMT -5
retired people drawing SS checks ALL paid into the system, they are NOT getting anything they dont deserve or already PAID for with their own work.
the "problem" with SS is congress STOLE the money my generation paid IN, there should be a HUGE SURPLUS sitting there paying todays retired with their own money.
IF the money i paid into the system was instead just put in a bank by me and drawing interest, i would have a huge nest egg that the interest from alone would pay far MORE than the SS check i am entitled to.
as to "appreciate" YOU have done NOTHING to deserve any appreciation from me dp.
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Post by phinehas on Jan 12, 2007 17:37:04 GMT -5
billt - all your points are valid up until the last sentence. You yourself say that the government has blown the money that you put in. There is nothing in the Social Security trust fund but an I.O.U., that being the case, it's not dixiepixie's or anyone elses fault of this generation and if it were not for the subsequent generations continuing to put money into it, there woudn't be any for you to collect a check out of.
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Post by dixiepixie on Jan 12, 2007 17:41:13 GMT -5
Well, I'm not sitting on my tushie trying to call out people like some kind of 50's greaser movie..."Meet me at the bowling Alley..." I am working every day and getting cut a huge amount of taxes and SSI and just CRAP. Geeze, grow up. I pay a good chunk of my check twice a month to FICA ( social security, don't ya know) and medicare tax. Where do you think that money is going? A check that you get on the 3rd of every month. It sure as hell won't be there when I am ready to collect anything (not that I will need it, since I have a retirement fund).
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Post by protege on Jan 12, 2007 21:09:07 GMT -5
BillT ...Its so hard not to slam them isn't it?
But as for the isue of social security and medicare...I think older people are entitled to it...they did work and pay in and should now receive back. What I dont agree with is the mothers who have their child diagnosed with some sorta of learning disability so they can collect a check. I'm sure many of us didn't grow up with any children who got a check because they couldn't read.
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Post by billt on Jan 12, 2007 21:19:17 GMT -5
those payments are a totally separate program that doesnt get paid into...the SSI thing is taxpayer supported from the general fund( i am fully aware that the SS surplus each year goes into that same general fund).
by the way i dont like the SS program, think it is unconstitutional and should be ended.
i even know how to do it and make everyone(exceot the politicians) happy.
close MANY illegal government agencies, end many of the programs, SELL the buildings and real estate they occupy, and PAY OFF the people that have paid into SS one lump sum covering what they are entitled to based on their payments into the system.
government according the constitution should be very inexpensive, the social programs of the great society and before that the new deal are the "problem".
under my plan the young folks no longer have a penny taken from their paychecks(of course they then are responsible for their own retirement), and the existing retirees get a sufficient payment to take care of their needs and they too are own their own from that day forward.
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Post by dixiepixie on Jan 12, 2007 21:56:07 GMT -5
What I dont agree with is the mothers who have their child diagnosed with some sorta of learning disability so they can collect a check. This was what I ment by not deserving nor appreciating it, and bill knew it full and well. This was hashed and re hashed a few months ago. bill likes to try and appear the victim and make it appear people are "out to get him" or "provoke him". This is the THIRD...not the first, not the second, but the THIRD forum he has made this claim on. He also like to use the "Meet me at the bowling alley" to try and provoke face to face confrontations. And i will say again, he needs to GROW UP.
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Post by dixiepixie on Jan 12, 2007 22:00:40 GMT -5
those payments are a totally separate program that doesnt get paid into... What total BS. If the tax money doesn't go to this then where does the money come from? Is it just manna from Heaven? And since you have such a dislike for this program, are you going to send back the next check you get on February 3rd? The DISABILITY check that you get because your back is so bad you can not work, but you can bowl? MY tax dollars and every other tax payer in Alabama is supporting that.
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Post by brandon on Jan 12, 2007 22:07:19 GMT -5
i even know how to do it and make everyone(exceot the politicians) happy. close MANY illegal government agencies, end many of the programs, SELL the buildings and real estate they occupy, and PAY OFF the people that have paid into SS one lump sum covering what they are entitled to based on their payments into the system. That's a fabulous idea. They wouldn't even have to give me back what I had already paid into the system if they'd just quit stealing money from me.
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Post by phinehas on Jan 12, 2007 22:14:48 GMT -5
fabulous idea eh....what about the large portion of the elderly that paid very little into it...their lump sum payment (of what THEY put into it) wouldn't last a year.
How long would your lump sum payment last billt? Your medication is expensive, is it not?
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Post by dixiepixie on Jan 12, 2007 22:19:32 GMT -5
I think if a person is TRUELY disabled, then the system that they have paid in to (maybe not long enough for retirement) is deserved, but for these people who fake injuries or people who have their kids signed up for a "dummy check", they should have to have WEEKLY exams and be willing to be filmed (at random with no for warning) at any time, kind of like a randon drug test.
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